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Post by Poekie on Apr 14, 2017 14:20:45 GMT 1
That's the point, that you don't need code access for my idea. Unless my memory is wrong and financial compensation have never been given before?
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Post by Schizm on Apr 15, 2017 11:19:00 GMT 1
most financial compensations we done were manually or the same amount for a large group of teams (which could easy be identified). We don't need code access but it might take an hour or more after every tour to divide the money for the white jersey ... I am not looking forward to such a prospect !
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Post by chakra on Apr 15, 2017 13:14:06 GMT 1
To do that manually would be a insane. It should be implemented in the program. But since you don't have access...  |
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Post by rarau on Apr 15, 2017 18:12:23 GMT 1
most financial compensations we done were manually or the same amount for a large group of teams (which could easy be identified). We don't need code access but it might take an hour or more after every tour to divide the money for the white jersey ... I am not looking forward to such a prospect !
1. Or increase the number of cyclist in training (up to 28-30)?
Or doing something about the financials.
2.* Increase the sponsorship
3.* Lower the wage of a trainer
4.* Get rid of the minimum subscribed cyclists in a stage
this issue discriminates the teammanagers in Div's with bot teams or with teammanagers forget/refuse to enlist a stage/tour.
5.* Award pricemoney to a youngster jersey in a tour
6.* Increase amount of supps for a stage/tour
i dont want to be always only against so i put this message from chakra. 1. this is difficult ? here i m not pro or against 5. seems difficult but 2 and 6 could be implemented? i think 2 could be easy implemented. also i said that in my oppinion u21 tour / races need to receive more money then normal races and this is easy to implement . But the same money from div 1.1 to div 5 p.s. and if some people are demotivated then put 200p for win a u21 race and not a restart. |
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Post by Poekie on Apr 16, 2017 20:06:00 GMT 1
most financial compensations we done were manually or the same amount for a large group of teams (which could easy be identified). We don't need code access but it might take an hour or more after every tour to divide the money for the white jersey ... I am not looking forward to such a prospect ! But if you award prices based on final standings, it's only an hour or less work once a season. |
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Post by Schizm on Apr 16, 2017 22:03:05 GMT 1
rarau : we wanted to up the sponsor money at the start of the season only to find lots of teams without sponsor, we could do a weekly change to fix that but then we have to run that very closely before every weekly update (to get all the new teams). A pity because this should be the easiest and most effective of al the suggestions in that list. most financial compensations we done were manually or the same amount for a large group of teams (which could easy be identified). We don't need code access but it might take an hour or more after every tour to divide the money for the white jersey ... I am not looking forward to such a prospect ! But if you award prices based on final standings, it's only an hour or less work once a season. the final standings of a tour aren't in the database, besides if we would run it once a season we might reward money to the wrong team (cyclists are bought ans sold along the way).
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Post by Poekie on Apr 16, 2017 22:20:44 GMT 1
Final standings of the whole season of course. They are posted here on the forums (you will have to trust Genomico that the calculations are correct, though it is possible to check it if people don't trust it).
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davyduck
U23 Developm. Team
http://www.peloton-game.com/teamdetails.aspx?id=10110
Posts: 72 
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Post by davyduck on Apr 18, 2017 14:47:03 GMT 1
Highering sponsor money will solve a lot?
It's a fact that more money comes into the game, equal for all managers, so prize money becomes less important. But will this really change something at the base?
A top team in div.2 earns averagely 400k per week, only prize money. A bottom team almost nothing. The amount of cash you must give to flatten the difference must be enormous. That is not going to happen!
Instead of equalizing everything, I think a better answer lays in inequality. Their must be big differences between divisions. THE biggest problem in this game in my opinion is that teams prefer not to promote because of economic motives. They are so depending of income out of prizemoney. So the answer is in highering sponsormoney for every higher division.
A few facts that don't make sense: - When I was 2 seasons ago in dv. 4 I had at a certain moment 8-9 million $. And I was only playing 1,5 seasons. - I see now 2 week old teams bidding for riders with salary over 30k. In fact those start-up teams if they do it right have better financial status then most 2nd and 3th div. teams. - I promote year after year even if I don't wont it.
With a stairseffect of sponsormoney these 3 events wont happen. And will be motivating to get that promotion, even when you know you will suck big time in the higher league. Top teams will have more money and will pay 20million instead of 2million for a top rider. And so he becomes totally unaffordable for a div.3 team. Who cares? And it's extra motivation to invest in youth and education even to sell riders to higher division teams. That way the market gets a boost. Lower division teams becomes sort of educationteams while they are crawling up. Prizemoney should stay important within the division, so top teams can prepare themselves for the higher division (or invest in the future)
I know that in my theory there is one big weak spot. The rich teams from Div.1 will never ever be beaten this way. But I'm sure there can be found a way to deal with this.
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Post by rarau on Apr 18, 2017 15:24:06 GMT 1
A top team in div.2 earns averagely 400k per week, only prize money.
A bottom team almost nothing.
The amount of cash you must give to flatten the difference must be enormous.
Instead of equalizing everything, I think a better answer lays in inequality.
Their must be big differences between divisions.
THE biggest problem in this game in my opinion is that teams prefer not to promote because of economic motives.
like you said only 2-3 teams per division win some money.
You cannot give more money for those 3 teams and the other 9 to bankrupt.
You need to give those 9 teams some money to survive -> sponsor money (is my oppinnion, i dont have power of decision )
30 000 per week from sponsor is too few on division 2, i believe something like 100 000 or more to be better.
And not many differences between divisions else De Droeftoeters will win always.
Please read this sepparatly
Yes i'm in your example, i want to promote only when my trained cyclists become stars and I have very good finances. I think is normal in every browser games.
Last seasons when i was on div 2.1 (i was 2 seasons in div 2 and i lost every season 2.000.000 )
Do you play other browser games? ( ex hattrick, d.o., or else i dont know what are now main games)
p.s. if you dont understand what i write upper in 2 words : i m not influenced by sponsor money , or other kind of modifications, i have enough to survive some more time on division 2 without changes in game/in my team
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Post by chakra on Apr 19, 2017 6:50:32 GMT 1
rarau : we wanted to up the sponsor money at the start of the season only to find lots of teams without sponsor, we could do a weekly change to fix that but then we have to run that very closely before every weekly update (to get all the new teams). A pity because this should be the easiest and most effective of al the suggestions in that list. Why do you have to wait for all teams to increase the sponsorship? Normally they know the rules of engagement and should have a sponsor. Every manager of the game can follow his sponsor. Even get a reminder to get a new sponsorcontract. I don't know how this programming thing works. But i would say isn't it just change the 30,000 into 80,000 (as example)? And i mean as well for new sponsorcontracts as for existing contracts. The same for trainer wages? But lowering the wages ofcourse. |
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Post by rarau on Apr 19, 2017 8:16:00 GMT 1
for davyduckpeloton.proboards.com/thread/9287/s17-3-1?page=2wheelnut : I think for you and maybe 2nd and third its fun winning all the time but for the majority of the division it is no fun just trying to survive on the scraps left on the table.
I think the game is broken and unbalanced and that is why everyone leaves (other than established rich teams) |
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davyduck
U23 Developm. Team
http://www.peloton-game.com/teamdetails.aspx?id=10110
Posts: 72
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Post by davyduck on Apr 19, 2017 9:06:23 GMT 1
rarau. I think you completely miss my point.
Probably because I'm bad in explaining.
1. The goal is not to make the rich richer. The goal is to give every team some future. When you make it always worth to promote. The best teams always promote and get out of your league. So the next season, there are chances for the weaker teams of that league. In this story you have to be realistic. A team like Droeftoeters who is dominating the game for so long, is logic that he is one of the best and richest teams in the game. You can't steal his earnings. So it's logic that he remains top the following years, and if he manages well, forever. It's not realistic that a new team can place himself next to Droeftoeters within a few seasons. So it will be very difficult for new teams to attend div.1, but isn't that life's rule. It is difficult (challenging) to become number 1. Now there is zero challenge to get from div 5 to 4. zero challenge to get to div 3.
Check real life. A conti team wont place themselves next to team sky. It will need a lot of effort for such a small conti team to become world tour.
2. Giving everybody equally 100.000$ sponsor money wont change a single thing. The big gap between the rich and the poor stays, because prize money and merchandising is important. Low-ranked teams definitely will bid for those +30k-salary-riders. And they will eventually come into troubles anyway.
I'm playing a lot of online games (too much), but non of them is comparable to peloton, because it's unique. So try not to compare it with other games.
And to end: I read way to often (between the lines) that div.1 is like a high-society club, which is impossible to reach for new managers. Sorry I always refer to myself but for the moment I have 26 riders. 21 are aged less then 28yr. And I will probably promote next year to div.1. And I have enough millions on my bank account (not my real bank account ). So it's not as hard as it seems. Okay I might have some luck ... (2.2 seems a more difficult division then 2.1, I suspect some managers in 2.1 that they don't want to promote, ...) So I'll promote this season, and probably relegate immediately, but no harm done with that. |
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Post by rarau on Apr 19, 2017 12:09:36 GMT 1
Now there is zero challenge to get from div 5 to 4. zero challenge to get to div 3.
Check real life. A conti team wont place themselves next to team sky. It will need a lot of effort for such a small conti team to become world tour.
2. Giving everybody equally 100.000$ sponsor money wont change a single thing. The big gap between the rich and the poor stays, because prize money and merchandising is important. Low-ranked teams definitely will bid for those +30k-salary-riders. And they will eventually come into troubles anyway.
I'm playing a lot of online games (too much), but non of them is comparable to peloton, because it's unique. So try not to compare it with other games.
For mostly of us is difficult to reach division 1.1
You cannot compare this season of div 2 with 4 seasons ago for example.
Now is easy on div 2 for me and you because ALL others have teenagers.
4 seasons ago was FAR difficult in div 2.
Yes is not challange on div 5 and 4 , here you are right.
I compare peloton with other games because is a game where the main thing is economy.
Who play this game not considering this a economy game is wrong
Ok... what is difference between 30.000 and 100.000 ?
Now a normal wage for a cyclist (not star) between 22-28 years is probably 10.000 $
this cyclist is not star and probably dont give you points/money
with 100.000 you could afford 10 cyclists
with 30.000 you could afford only 3
this is the reason that sponsor money need to raise and not supporters or prices on races because if number of supp raise then richer team become reacher.
If someone have wage 600.000 $ per week like me is his problem, here i speak about team who wants to survive, who have normal wages on their cyclists.
Again is not about me i have enough money to survive in div 2.
Edit ... grammar
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Post by ElGringo on Apr 19, 2017 14:23:07 GMT 1
I made a testament but my laptop crash when I was finishing writting, so I will not write all again. Yes we need to do something for the game to have managers playing and the sponsor seems a good solution but I think we don't have access to that, because is in the code. I will have another look and see if is possible but isn't my call because Schizm is also taking care of the game and I think we is more conservative about that but we can find a solution. Fromt he time we keep the game alive we already rise the supporters, gave extra money in the 10th aniversary and increase the price money in certain races so we will see a balance way to prevent teams to go bankrupt so easy. |
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Post by Mike on Dec 15, 2017 18:27:24 GMT 1
I challenge ElGringo to post stats from Naz  |
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Melres United
