phantom
Cycling Tourist Group
Posts: 4
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Post by phantom on Feb 10, 2017 20:35:18 GMT 1
I have been playing Peloton for quite a few years now, but sadly this season will be my last.
The game has some fantastic ideas that have been developed very well over the years, but I have reached the conclusion that the economic system is broken.
My team is currently a yo-yo team. I can cruise through division 4, but I cannot compete in division 3. In some ways this is just as well because if I ever survived a season in division 3 I would be bankrupt.
I just had to get rid of my trainer as I could no longer afford his weekly wage of over 250k. He was not maxed out or anything, just slightly better than average across the board.
By contrast my sponsor brings in 27k per week. My cyclists wages combined are 199k per week.
So the only way to survive is to earn cash from races - Easy in Div 4; sparse pickings in Div 3 - or sell merchandise.
I am not a sports economist but I would be amazed if professional cycling teams relied more on sales of water bottles for their cash than on money from sponsors.
So I fired my fairly good trainer and hired a rubbish trainer; he still costs 31k per week - more than any of my cyclists. Still at least I stay afloat.
I once had a youth scout. Cost me an arm and a leg. never found me a cyclist. Not one. I binned him pretty quick.
Cyclists hang around my team getting older and older, Very few young cyclists come up for sale and unless you spend astronomical money on a youth scout, your team, no matter how big and successful they are, never attract any young cyclists. Not necessarily good young cyclists, I mean ANY young cyclists.
So I am about to be relegated from Div 3 again, which ironically is the best thing to happen as I have no money. Next season I will build up money in Div 4 by winning lots of races with my half decent squad. Only problem is I will probably get promoted. The best thing to do would be to finish 3rd for several seasons to try and build up a huge fighting fund. but, I don't want to do that.
So this is a farewell moan I guess. I am sorry it has to be a moan, because I have enjoyed this game for a long time, but the numbers no longer add up for me. The things that need fixing are having a bigger an bigger impact on my enjoyment. And I don't want to spend a season trying to find cunning ways of making lots of money yet not getting promoted.
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Post by Poekie on Feb 11, 2017 1:58:25 GMT 1
I can understand that it is a problem for the game if some teams are having financial problems, but it is also a problem if no team has financial problems. If everyone is making money easily, there will be inflation and money budgetting is not an important part of the game anymore.
I can understand it's frustrating for you to have money problems, but I think you can make a few changes to get a positive income. Get rid if the cyclists who have a high salary without getting good results. Get some oldies with good stats but <10k salary instead.
You are right about your trainer: rubbish. With little money, a single skill trainer is the way to go I think.
You are not right getting young cyclists. I recently sold a 20 year old for 8k. Not a very good one, but not that bad also. There will be many more 20 year old on the transferlist. And I bought an 18 year old for 1k. I also see quite a few 23-25 year olds on the transfer market now.
I also think it's wise to put the money you win in investments, so you have a regular income.
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phantom
Cycling Tourist Group
Posts: 4
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Post by phantom on Feb 11, 2017 9:26:36 GMT 1
Thanks Poekie, I have investments, but at the rate I am losing money around 150k per week they will be gone by season end.
Yes there are some young cyclists on the market, but not many and I think this is because most teams have no youth scout, because they cost so much. I would like to see the transfers market seeded with regular, young and possibly, low quality cyclists.
I agree if everyone has too much money then you may as well do away with money. As I said I have played the game for some years and I would expect to struggle as a new manager and I would expect to struggle during periods of crisis or when I get relegated, or if I do something really stupid. But the solution to a cash crisis should not be to drop a division to make easy money. A team like mine should be fighting tooth and nail to stay in Div 3 for financial security and because there is less financial security in a lower division.
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Post by Poekie on Feb 11, 2017 13:40:21 GMT 1
Well, at the moment there are 16 youngsters at the transfermarket. It is possible that very few teams will have youth scouts; in that case the prices of younsters will rise, which will make it more attractive to get one. I agree that at the moment having a youth scout is more a hobby than a wise financial investment.
It would be better if relegating to earn money would not be a wise strategy, but it is as it is.
Anyway, looking at your team, one example: Hielke Otsen. I checked his results, just one time in the top 10 (6th place). You pay him 249440 for a full season. He makes maybe 50k in price money and supps? So that is 200k loss. I would fire him. There are problably some more cyclists who just cost you money. You still need good riders in your team of course, but you need to focus on keeping salaries low.
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phantom
Cycling Tourist Group
Posts: 4
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Post by phantom on Feb 12, 2017 10:04:14 GMT 1
Yes Otsen is very expensive, but he is a 13 rated leader. He never wins races himself as I never push him into the red; he enables others to win. Of course it could very well be that the reason my failure is that I am not playing this game right.
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Post by Poekie on Feb 12, 2017 18:18:56 GMT 1
Ah, for his LS he might be worth the money. I have seen cheaper leaders on the market I think, but it's not so easy to find them.
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Post by Ab Normaal on Feb 13, 2017 9:57:11 GMT 1
Hi Phantom,
It would be a shame if you (one of the managers from the start) quit. I understand your point, but what you can do is buy another leader. On the TL is now Gazeau, an old leader. He is worthless as a cyclist bus has enough LS points to be helpful for a at least two seasons.
Take a look at manager of J.M. Jimenez. Het is in 2:1 and is in 2nd position with only 10 riders. He has a fitness trainer with a few old riders en can ride with these 10 riders almost any race and win a lot of money. I know since he is a colleague of mine. He earns a lot of money every single race because his costs are very low. No youthscout, a cheap trainer and not a lot of salary costs.
If you would relagate to div. 4, fire al your riders except for the best 8, buy two older, good riders on the TL and take a fitness 15 trainer. You can win almost every race in div. 4 and earn shitloads of money. These riders will gain in mood a lot which means you can do the same trick in div 3 the season after that.
Then you will see that you'll have a lot of money to spend when you start with your new strategy.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 15:59:05 GMT 1
I have been playing Peloton for quite a few years now, but sadly this season will be my last.
The game has some fantastic ideas that have been developed very well over the years, but I have reached the conclusion that the economic system is broken.
My team is currently a yo-yo team. I can cruise through division 4, but I cannot compete in division 3. In some ways this is just as well because if I ever survived a season in division 3 I would be bankrupt.
I just had to get rid of my trainer as I could no longer afford his weekly wage of over 250k. He was not maxed out or anything, just slightly better than average across the board.
By contrast my sponsor brings in 27k per week. My cyclists wages combined are 199k per week.
So the only way to survive is to earn cash from races - Easy in Div 4; sparse pickings in Div 3 - or sell merchandise.
I am not a sports economist but I would be amazed if professional cycling teams relied more on sales of water bottles for their cash than on money from sponsors.
So I fired my fairly good trainer and hired a rubbish trainer; he still costs 31k per week - more than any of my cyclists. Still at least I stay afloat.
I once had a youth scout. Cost me an arm and a leg. never found me a cyclist. Not one. I binned him pretty quick.
Cyclists hang around my team getting older and older, Very few young cyclists come up for sale and unless you spend astronomical money on a youth scout, your team, no matter how big and successful they are, never attract any young cyclists. Not necessarily good young cyclists, I mean ANY young cyclists.
So I am about to be relegated from Div 3 again, which ironically is the best thing to happen as I have no money. Next season I will build up money in Div 4 by winning lots of races with my half decent squad. Only problem is I will probably get promoted. The best thing to do would be to finish 3rd for several seasons to try and build up a huge fighting fund. but, I don't want to do that.
So this is a farewell moan I guess. I am sorry it has to be a moan, because I have enjoyed this game for a long time, but the numbers no longer add up for me. The things that need fixing are having a bigger an bigger impact on my enjoyment. And I don't want to spend a season trying to find cunning ways of making lots of money yet not getting promoted.
i totally agree with you, when you say "the economic system is broken" "I am not a sports economist but I would be amazed if professional cycling teams relied more on sales of water bottles for their cash than on money from sponsors" The only way, in the game, to gain proper money is winning races, but to win races in higher divisions you need to invest a lot of money, in experient cyclists and a better trainer, and "pray" to have luck. Because if you have bad luck your team will have serious financial problems and you will need to sell your investments, dismiss your trainer or both. In this type of games the scouting usually represent another path, less expensive, to have some sucess - creating a young team and make them growth and make money with them - but i have a youngscout (13-13-15, 114.258$) since 2014, and my conclusion is, have a youngscout, like my own, in this game is like have a very expensive "pet", its cool have one but in reality is almost useless. I never have a 20-20-20 youngscout perhaps this be usefull. In order to provide another path to the weaker teams, and help them to make some money (selling young cyclists) and create a competive team without take serious financial risks, i want to ask if is possible make a experiment, and cut in half the youngscout salary during the next two seasons
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Post by rarau on Feb 13, 2017 17:20:33 GMT 1
Yes there are some young cyclists on the market, but not many and I think this is because most teams have no youth scout, because they cost so much. I would like to see the transfers market seeded with regular, young and possibly, low quality cyclists. i put now 2 cylists 18y old on transfer list. Now are 11 cyclists 18y old on transfer list. Are not enough? I bought this season a lot of 19y cyclists for few bucks ... so how are not so enought cyclist on tl?? Frantisek Dobrogeanu looks very good but have low bids... i give my scout 54 880 $ per week ... i will see if my cyclists from scout are sold with this money or not. So maybe in other parts you have right but about youngsters you are not right. Are enough cyclists on trasnfer list.
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Post by rarau on Feb 13, 2017 17:35:04 GMT 1
ok it looks your name kown
Stockport Angels (39)
i see you start from begininning
you train correctly till now? because your trainer is useless
kills Flat 5 Hill 5 Mountain 5 Fitness 5 Downhill 0 Sprint 5 Time trial 10
you dont sell anything on 5 years
maybe you need some advices from someone who now how to play this game good.
how to have results with Martino Truffelli with 17 injuries ?!?
he need more tt and hill to have good results.
Lupul Dobre have awesome mood, very happpy, but probably low skills if he is only at 9000 $ per week and he is on your team from a long time.
If you have more youngsters you could compete against Schizm on youngsters area.
Is difficult to have awesome results knowing that me and Joanteam have some nice awesome cyclists. Only Masek from Schizm could compete with us.
You cannot compete against my cyclists 33-35 year almost fully trained with your 30 years cyclists maybe not fully trained.
Ask Ab Normaal, Schizm, Poekie for help. And show them your cyclists and they advice you if you need to sell them or to keep. Next season will be easier with me and Joan on this division -> hoping some youngsters team come in our group .
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Post by rarau on Feb 13, 2017 17:48:33 GMT 1
how to have good results on Spain with this 2?
Ives van Dokkum (127218) 24 years
Alex Delangle (120332) 25 years
i compete with 34-36 years cyclists . YOu cannot have results with some children.
Or play with 20 years cyclists or with +30 years
See Team Franconia from 2.1 one of the best managers from this game. Have 3 cyclists 26-27 years and all the other 22 your younger. Because have a young team he dont have results and he will relegate.
See Theodor Timm (112858) with his wage on 27 years probably he is at least 14-15 mountain with him. And even he is so wonderfull have only 49 points on div 2.1 So how can you compete with this 2 on Spain ?!?
On TTT from Spain you finish 4 so very nice results for you.
You have Parvu on place 9 on GS of Spain Also on teams you are on place 4
I see you have Sasaono place 13 on Italy and 14 on France. On France your team finish 5 Do you attack with your general standing cyclists? With what fitness he finish Italy?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 17:50:01 GMT 1
Yes there are some young cyclists on the market, but not many and I think this is because most teams have no youth scout, because they cost so much. I would like to see the transfers market seeded with regular, young and possibly, low quality cyclists. i put now 2 cylists 18y old on transfer list. Now are 11 cyclists 18y old on transfer list. Are not enough? I bought this season a lot of 19y cyclists for few bucks ... so how are not so enought cyclist on tl?? Frantisek Dobrogeanu looks very good but have low bids... i give my scout 54 880 $ per week ... i will see if my cyclists from scout are sold with this money or not. So maybe in other parts you have right but about youngsters you are not right. Are enough cyclists on trasnfer list. if the majority of these 11 cyclists have the capacity to turn into good cyclists in the future, i will give you all the reason.
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Post by rarau on Feb 13, 2017 18:20:19 GMT 1
if the majority of these 11 cyclists have the capacity to turn into good cyclists in the future, i will give you all the reason.
ok then to show my children 606 409 1-6 1-0 23y 724 232 9-8 2-0 21y 527 030 7-8 1-1 20y they looks perfect? you think Franconia or Slyer have only 14 5 5 5 5 14 cyclists? or 7 7 15 5 9 14 cyclists? with 20 steering and balance? all the youngsters have low steering and balance. transfer history of Matatias Manole Date From To Price 7/20/2016 Luptatorii din Rarau Eagles Cycling Team $1,100,000 now he have 19 years Ignatie Georghiu-Dej (133752) of joachim1107 (245) captain on his U20 team Matatias Eminescu (132004) won for his team Semtex 247 points last season Matatias Eminescu or someone else from my youngsters, i dont remember now, is captain nr 1 on his team. And all this from my scout
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 18:58:46 GMT 1
if the majority of these 11 cyclists have the capacity to turn into good cyclists in the future, i will give you all the reason.
ok then to show my children 606 409 1-6 1-0 23y 724 232 9-8 2-0 21y 527 030 7-8 1-1 20y they looks perfect? you think Franconia or Slyer have only 14 5 5 5 5 14 cyclists? or 7 7 15 5 9 14 cyclists? with 20 steering and balance? all the youngsters have low steering and balance. transfer history of Matatias Manole Date From To Price 7/20/2016 Luptatorii din Rarau Eagles Cycling Team $1,100,000 now he have 19 years Ignatie Georghiu-Dej (133752) of joachim1107 (245) captain on his U20 team Matatias Eminescu (132004) won for his team Semtex 247 points last season Matatias Eminescu or someone else from my youngsters, i dont remember now, is captain nr 1 on his team. And all this from my scout So explain to me why i should keep my youngscout instead of buy young cyclists from other teams Why you don't have a 20-20-20 youngscout, or a 15-15-15 for example?
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Post by rarau on Feb 14, 2017 13:25:07 GMT 1
So explain to me why i should keep my youngscout instead of buy young cyclists from other teams
Why you don't have a 20-20-20 youngscout, or a 15-15-15 for example?
1. i cannot answer on this, i posted only to show phantom that are some nice cyclists on tl. If you want to change generation then you could use a scout and buy also from tl like Genomico, Franconia do.
2. I cannot afford a better scout. Plus i have an old team. When i will change my generations probably i will have a 10 15 10 or 10 15 15.
p.s. when i m on div 3 i win 2.000.000 , when i m in div 2 i lost 2.000.000 per season
but this season and last season i was on 0 (on div 3) and i m afraid what i will do next season on div 2.
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