attacking tactics in races

[wheelnut]

Previously posed here was a comment you have to attack from the first attack point. My question is most stages or races have at least 5 attack points some up to 9. Do you attack at all the early ones until you run out of leadership points or attack for the first two or three and the last one?

how do you gain the mountain points or sprint points if those are down the road several attack points later?

is it worth keeping some points back for helpers?

Does the GC tactic ever work and in what circumstances. When I put my GC contender on GC he just loses places in the GC and goes backward even with helpers.

Does final sprint ever work as everyone seems to attack from the off?

I am in the Giro at present well down the GC due to crap performance in the TTT on the first stage. What is the best tactics from now on? claw up the GC to get a top 10? Forget GC and try for stage wins? go for a jersey, polka dot or green? support my young cyclist in the white jersey (he is second BTW at present).

Lots of questions I know but just a little confused what to do to get the most out of the race engine.

[wheelnut]

Sorry lol meant TDF...got confused with real life as Giro on the telly at the mo!

[rarau]

1. My question is most stages or races have at least 5 attack points some up to 9. Do you attack at all the early ones until you run out of leadership points or attack for the first two or three and the last one?

you could attack with a cyclist ONLY for 5 times


2. how do you gain the mountain points or sprint points if those are down the road several attack points later?

? be on attacking group, having good skill for that mountain/sprint point

3. is it worth keeping some points back for helpers?

i dont think so

4. Does the GC tactic ever work and in what circumstances. When I put my GC contender on GC he just loses places in the GC and goes backward even with helpers.

i dont know, maybe only on sprint stages of a big tour


5. Does final sprint ever work as everyone seems to attack from the off?

only on sprint stages

6. I am in the Giro at present well down the GC due to crap performance in the TTT on the first stage. What is the best tactics from now on? claw up the GC to get a top 10? Forget GC and try for stage wins? go for a jersey, polka dot or green? support my young cyclist in the white jersey (he is second BTW at present).

you choose.

for polka dot you need to have good luck
for green to have good luck / or be an attacker
best choice probably stage wins

[Schizm]

I hardly use GC tactic , if you want a jersey there are basically only two options (except in the TT and Sprint stages) : Save Fitness or Attack.
Attack in the first and then select the other attackpoints where your rider can make the difference (but in a tour you often have to choose between stagewins and GC if your leader hasn't got enough leadership points).
Helpers can be usefull but only use them if you have leadership points left because attacks (and save fitness) should have the priority. (except if you insist on using the GC or sprint -tactic)

But I can go on , tactics just depend on the race, the tour, your strengths, your opponents strengths ... there is no one way to do things.

P.S. : even if you build a team for the future you have to invest in (older) cyclists that generate income right now because you will be bankrupted by the time your youngsters start to make a living (in a really active division)

edit : plus what Rarau sayed

[ElGringo]

I will use this to give an info.

We will try for next season to make some adjusts about the influence of TT and the number of helpers working in the peloton to catch the escapes.

Also there will stages with only late attacking points to give some diversity of tactics.

[Poekie]

Todays race can give you some insight in the value of attacks on different places.

White jersey will give points, but no money. Other jerseys give both so are more valuable.

[wheelnut]

Thanks Poekie,

Yes I need to replay Friday's stage, did quite well with a cyclist starting only on 80% and only set at 75% effort.

I did not realise white jersey gave no money! The effort will not centre there as I need the cash not the points :-)

[chakra]

Winning a white jersey increases the mood of that youngster.

Depending on the skills of your cyclist it is not Always necessarly to attack at the first point.

I won races on attacking the first time on 3rd point (and following points)

The GC tactics is a big questionmark for me as well.

Final sprint is ok when you want the cyclist to end first of his bunch. It could bring you points and money.

To win mountain jersey you have to attack and be first at the mountain sprint. As well for the points jersey.

The points jersey: good sprint skill to win the sprint points and win stages or at least be in the top 10 of every stage.

[wheelnut]

Thanks Chakra...

I do get torn when faced with a stage of a tour when I have maybe two or three riders in the team capable of least taking some points or even possibly a stage win.

Generally with good leadership values I might have up to 5 attack points with one rider and a few over. If I select one good rider to attack then sometimes I just pile in for the first 5 attack points and hope he can hang for the last 3 or 4 attack points. Sometimes I pile in for the first 3 leaving the last 2 to attack. I am unclear which is best and I get mixed results from both.

The other four riders (non attacking) I sort of left on 70% and limbo for me. I do switch a few to helper but does this do anything? Especially if I am attacking? I might switch one to GC as this costs nothing in fitness but again do not see much result for this. Is it ever worth attacking with more than one rider? I see some of my rivals do this. will they assist each other or actually work against each other i.e. be counter productive?

I do feel I 'waste' the talent of the other riders if they do not have a purpose in the race.

Maybe I aiming too high and should just 100% with each of the five riders on different stages to win stages only and forget points, mountain and GC?

If not surely all you need is 4 or 5 uber riders and the rest very ordinary to make up numbers?

Last thought, if the other non attacking riders do not serve much purpose any downside to fielding less than the 5 to fill all the slots?

[rarau]

Disappointed supporters : not participating or participating with less than 3 cyclists in a tour will disappoint some supporters and they will leave the fanclub for that week.

Maybe I aiming too high and should just 100% with each of the five riders on different stages to win stages only and forget points, mountain and GC?

for all is difficult to win points and GC
in some tours mountain jersey is more easy to win then points jersey.