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Post by Genomico on Dec 21, 2011 16:40:39 GMT 1
Indeed, 16 active teams in division 3 would be too much if division 4 is left with much less active teams on average. Then divisions of 8 teams would make much more sense. So, nice proposal NikeBoy.
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Post by Genomico on Dec 21, 2011 16:52:56 GMT 1
And with 16 divisions of 8 teams, the 3rd season you can fill division 2 by promoting the numbers 1 and 2 of division 3 to 4 divisions of 8 teams. Division 3 then can be filled up again by division 4 teams.
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Post by Schizm on Dec 21, 2011 16:53:34 GMT 1
I don't like it, to me it seems like a reward to those who finish this season in second place. They will end up in a division with more teams (10-14 real teams, if the number in the top corner is correct) but less competition then those who finished in first place. Personally I think 8 teams per division is too low, more teams will only make the game more interesting. And if that would mean less income in the game I gladly will pay that price.
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Post by Genomico on Dec 21, 2011 17:12:29 GMT 1
But NikeBoy has a good point that the average number of (active) teams in each division-level should not differ too much. So if you have 16x16 teams in division 3, you will have like 8 active (of which <4 started from the beginning) teams on average in division 4. So that would be a gigantic advantage for the number 3-4s of this season, unless the prizemoney will increase incredibly in division 3.
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Post by Schizm on Dec 21, 2011 17:19:35 GMT 1
1000 active managers - 128 in 3rd = 872 teams divided by 64 divisions in 4th = 13,625 teams left in 4th.
edit : with 16 teams in 3rd there will be about 12 human teams per divsion in 4th and remember in the 4th the number can grow because of new teams signing up, which will not be the case in 3th division.
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Post by Quatannens on Dec 21, 2011 18:05:42 GMT 1
In all these proposals not once is mentioned that the teams in division 3 will earn more then those in division 4 if they win a race. So the competition must be higher, otherwise the gap between teams will only grow. So in higher divisions more competition, but more earnings. Only 'weaker' champions will earn less, but they had less competition in the first season. So I think we just must the game let do it's thing (controlled a little bit, by proposals of promotion/delegation) and everything will end up balanced.
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Post by NikeBoy on Dec 21, 2011 19:24:42 GMT 1
Good point that the earnings differ between 3rd and 4th. In an ideal world, the situation we want to create, is that the money earned in 3rd is more spread over teams, in a way that the average in 3rd is almost the same as the top2 in 4th. But we know that this is hard to get. More teams in 3rd (let's take 16), means less chance that 1 team will rule. However I disagree with this : Only 'weaker' champions will earn less, but they had less competition in the first season. I think the ones with less competition now, will earn the most, and will be the strongest, also because training is almost the same per division. So the skills of the cyclists will be more or less the same (from a strenght point of view) but they will have more money to buy more better cyclists. Worst thing that can happen is that such a team wins the majority of the races in 3rd and the 15 other teams (or let's say the 12 weakest teams) will earn almost nothing. So, more teams, more chance of different winners, but also chance that more teams will earn very little (and so the 3rd and 4th place this season are the rewarding positions ) Discussion ongoing ...
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Post by newborn on Dec 22, 2011 12:08:28 GMT 1
I think this decision should have been taken in the beginning of the season, because now i'm in third place in my division and i'm now busy building the team for next season rather than becoming second or first
If i had known that all the first places are going to third division and the others to fourth, i would have done more effort to end first...
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Post by JF Taffonneau on Dec 23, 2011 10:39:17 GMT 1
I agree with Newborn Promoting rules have to remain as they were defined at the beginning of the season as they have a great influence on the strategy followed by most of the managers.
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Post by Schizm on Dec 23, 2011 10:54:49 GMT 1
I think the main problem was that at the beginning of the season there was no way to foresee the amount of teams active at the end of the season. I think else we would have started in division 4 instead of 5 because then a more regular pattern could be followed (the first 5 would promote instead of 2 because division 3 is empty).
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Post by Schizm on Dec 23, 2011 11:13:28 GMT 1
I agree with Newborn Promoting rules have to remain as they were defined at the beginning of the season as they have a great influence on the strategy followed by most of the managers. There where no rules defined at the beginning of the season according to me. To me it was always clear that the 4 teams in green promoting only would work as intented when the higher divisions were filled. However there is one solution if you really want to hold on to that 4 : make 32 divisions of 16 teams in 3rd and put the remaining human teams in 32 divisions in 4th. The top 2 of each 3rd division then will promote to 2nd (4 times 16 teams). Numbers 3 to 10 would stay in 3rd and would be joined by the first 2 of the 4th division (which would create the required 16 times 20 teams in 3rd). Positions 11-16 would relegate to 4th to join the teams that don't promote (4th would be redivided over 64 divisions (of 20 teams max)).
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tijsco
Cycling Tourist Group
Posts: 15
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Post by tijsco on Dec 23, 2011 12:36:34 GMT 1
What about promoting the 128 champions to level 3 (8 teams per division) and the rest promote to level 4. There will be something like 12 teams per division in level 4, but maybe 8 active on average. This way, there is enough room to grow in 4th. Also with 8 teams in level 3, no one will be relegated the season after, and 8 teams will be in each division in level 2. If you completely fill up level 3 then teams might complain that they'd rather play in 4th (less competition, more wins, more money) than in 3rd (bottem half will barely win anything ...) In this way, the champions of this season are rewarded (and not punished ) I totally agree with Nikeboy!
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Post by JF Taffonneau on Dec 23, 2011 13:57:46 GMT 1
I agree with Newborn Promoting rules have to remain as they were defined at the beginning of the season as they have a great influence on the strategy followed by most of the managers. There where no rules defined at the beginning of the season according to me. To me it was always clear that the 4 teams in green promoting only would work as intented when the higher divisions were filled. However there is one solution if you really want to hold on to that 4 : make 32 divisions of 16 teams in 3rd and put the remaining human teams in 32 divisions in 4th. The top 2 of each 3rd division then will promote to 2nd (4 times 16 teams). Numbers 3 to 10 would stay in 3rd and would be joined by the first 2 of the 4th division (which would create the required 16 times 20 teams in 3rd). Positions 11-16 would relegate to 4th to join the teams that don't promote (4th would be redivided over 64 divisions (of 20 teams max)). Your proposal is fair, I like it very much
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Post by lee1950 on Dec 24, 2011 1:12:34 GMT 1
I don't worry what the promotion rules are: I'm still planning to finish first this season . Next season, my goal will be to finish top-4 --- wherever that is .
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Post by chakra on Dec 27, 2011 20:29:07 GMT 1
I don't worry what the promotion rules are: I'm still planning to finish first this season . Next season, my goal will be to finish top-4 --- wherever that is . I agree. What promotion rules are or will be is up to IP and his team. However first 4 must promote. I believe that is a rule set at the beginning of the season.
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